Clarifying the Number of Days Wade Robson Spent Alone with Michael Jackson

May 8, 2020

One prevalent myth surrounding Wade Robson's allegations against Michael Jackson centres on the perceived inconsistency of his claims. Critics assert that since Wade stated he was molested hundreds of times but only visited Neverland four times in 14 years, his account doesn’t add up. However, this conclusion is based on a misunderstanding of Wade’s statements and the nature of his interactions with Jackson.

The Context of Wade’s Claims

Wade has consistently maintained that the abuse did not only occur at Neverland Ranch. In both the documentary “Leaving Neverland” and his legal documentation, he clarifies that the abuse took place any time he was left alone with Michael Jackson or shared a bed with him. This context is crucial, as it broadens the scope of potential abuse beyond the limited number of visits to Neverland.

Clarifying Misleading Quotes

One quote often referenced by Jackson's defenders comes from Joy Robson, Wade's mother. She states, “We’ve only been to the ranch with Michael four times in 14 years.” While this statement is accurate, it is often presented without the full context. Joy’s quote is prefaced with, “In all the time we have lived here since 1991…” This timeframe omits the critical period from January 1990 to September 1991, when the Robson family visited Michael Jackson at Neverland numerous times before permanently relocating to the United States in 1991.

Q. And then from that point, from September of 16 1991 up till, let's just say, September 1993 - okay? - the time frame involved, you and your son spent a great deal of time with Michael Jackson, you were around him a lot, correct?

A. I don't think so.

Q. You were not at the ranch on a number of occasions during 1991?

A. My memory is in the entire time we've lived here since 1991, we've only been at the ranch with Michael on four occasions in 14 years.

In his amended civil lawsuit, Wade Robson provides a detailed account of his experiences with Michael Jackson, which  includes his well-known visits to Neverland and various locations, including condos in Westwood and Century City.

Wade states:

The sexual activities between DECEDENT and Plaintiff continued regularly in total for a seven (7) year period from the time Plaintiff was seven (7) years old until Plaintiff was fourteen (14) years old. Plaintiff lived with his mother and sister in Los Angeles (they returned to Australia to visit every two years or so). Plaintiff would stay with DECEDENT from time to time, dividing their time between Neverland and the Hideout in Century City when they were together.

In Leaving Neverland, after Wade's family permanently relocated to the United States, he reflects on his experiences during his first year in Los Angeles (Part 1, min 1:52:12):

"I would estimate that I saw him four to six times at most—either at his apartment in Century City or at Neverland. Each night, we would engage in sexual encounters. Whenever I was alone with him, it would inevitably lead to sex, which provided me a fleeting sense of reassurance, making me feel that everything was okay and that life was returning to normal. However, that feeling was short-lived as I soon found myself facing increasingly complex situations with him."

How many times was Wade alone with Jackson?

This estimate relies on the cross-examinations of Wade, Joy, and Chantal Robson in 2005. Anyone questioning the credibility of their testimonies should consider that they were speaking in favour of Michael Jackson’s defence.

Although Wade denied any abuse during his testimony, the frequency of late nights and moments spent alone with Michael Jackson is concerning. 

Let’s begin with Wade's 2005 testimony:

Q. All right. Now, during that period of time from age eight until age 11, did you frequently visit Mr. Jackson?

A. From -- I’m sorry, from eight to 11?

Q. Age eight to age 11, did you frequently visit Mr. Jackson?

A. Yeah. Same amount of time. Maybe twice a year, or every couple of months, something like that.

Q. Is it safe to say that during each of those visits, you stayed in Mr. Jackson’s room?

A. Yes.

Q. All right. Were there ever occasions where you went to visit Mr. Jackson when your mother wasn’t there?

A. Yes. I think a couple of times he had an apartment in Century City that my mother would drop me off and I’d stay for, you know, a night or so by myself with Michael there.

Q. Was that a place called “The Hideout”?

A. I remember a place called “The Hideout.” I don’t remember if it was that place.

Q. Were there more places where you visited and stayed overnight in Century City?

A. Yeah, there was a hotel that was -- I mean, I’m sorry, an apartment that was in Westwood and then one that was in Century City.

Q. Was there a place where Mr. Jackson was living in, either Westwood or Century City, where there was a hotel across the street?

A. Yes.

Q. And would it be the case that periodically you would visit him there, your mother would stay in the hotel, but you would stay with him in his room?

A. One time when we came over, we stayed -- I think it was the Westwood apartment, his Westwood apartment. There was a Holiday Inn that was across and we stayed there most of the time. And then certain nights I would go over to Michael and stay with him.

With the exception of three or four occasions when he stayed elsewhere, Wade predominantly slept beside Michael Jackson.

Q. Mr. Robson, were there ever occasions where you stayed with Michael Jackson where you didn’t sleep with him in his bed?

A. Yes.

Q. How often did that happen?

A. I don’t know. Maybe three, four times.

Q. Three or four times over years we’re talking about; is that right?

A. Yes.

Q. So, for the most part, the overwhelming majority of times you shared his bed with him?

A. Yes.

Wade testified that he could recall only one or two instances of sleepovers with other children. He also mentioned that during their stay at a hotel in Las Vegas, he shared a room with Michael while his mother stayed in a separate room.

Q. When you were in the hotel in Las Vegas, it is true that you stayed with Mr. Jackson in his bed?

A. Yes.

Q. And your mother stayed in a separate room; is that right?

A. Yes.

Q. Now, were there other boys that you knew about who were sleeping with Michael Jackson during that time?

A. No, not that I knew of. I mean, the only other time I was around other boys, other kids at the ranch, I think once or twice, and, you know, we’d all stay in the room and we’d kind of fall asleep on couches, beds, cots, wherever they were.

Despite the abuse allegations that emerged in 1993, Wade continued to stay overnight with Michael Jackson. At that time, Wade was just eleven years old.

Q. During the period of time from age eight on, did you stay in Mr. Jackson’s room virtually the entire time? 

A. I’m sorry? 

Q. The times that you would come and visit Mr. Jackson from age eight on -- 

A. Uh-huh. 

Q. -- did you stay in Mr. Jackson’s room?

A. Yes.

Q. All right. By age 11, you were asked to give a deposition, were you not? 

A. Yes. 

Q. And you actually did give testimony under oath in the presence of two prosecutors from Los Angeles; is that right? 

A. Yes. 

Q. There was also an attorney present who represented you; is that correct? 

A. Yes. 

Q. All right. After that deposition, did you continue to sleep in Mr. Jackson’s room? 

A. Yes. 

Q. Did you continue to sleep in Mr. Jackson’s bed? 

A. Yes. 

In December 1993, Michael called Joy late at night to invite her and her son, Wade, to Neverland. They arrived at 1:30 AM. Wade went to Michael's room, but Joy does not recall where he slept that night.

Q. Now, in December of 1993, after the allegations with Jordan Chandler had surfaced, Mr. Jackson came back to the United States, correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And on -- to your knowledge, on the very first night he was back he called your son, correct?

A. He called me.

Q. He called you?

A. I think so. From memory.

Q. Do you remember testifying that you weren’t at the house when the call was made, that you were out with some ladies?

A. I do remember reading that, I’m sorry.

Q. So you weren’t there?

A. Possibly.

Q. You came home, and then both of you, late in the night, drove to Neverland Valley Ranch, correct?

A. Correct.

Q. When you got to Neverland Valley Ranch, it was about 1:30 in the morning, correct?

A. Correct.

 Q. When you got there, you went to the guest quarters and your son went to Mr. Jackson’s bedroom, correct?

A. I don’t remember where I slept, but he did go to Michael’s bedroom.

During a visit in May 1990, the Robsons stayed at the Holiday Inn across the street from Jackson's condo in Westwood. 

Q. Now, these visits to The Holiday -- these visits to Mr. Jackson when you were staying at The Holiday Inn, many of those calls from Mr. Jackson were very late at night; isn’t that correct?

A. Yes, he was working.

MR. SNEDDON: Move to strike as nonresponsive, Your Honor.

THE COURT: I’ll strike the last -- after “Yes.”

Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: And he would call, and on some occasions you would walk your son across the street, correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And you’d leave him there and go back to the hotel?

A. Yes.

Q. And there was just he and Mr. Jackson together?

A. Yes.

Q. And you knew that at that particular point in time, that he was sleeping with Mr. Jackson in Mr. Jackson’s bed, correct?

A. Yes.

This incident reportedly occurred during a six-week trip.

Q. Now, at the time that you came over here for the L.A. Gear commercial, you were staying in The Holiday Inn?

A. Yes. In Westwood.

Q. And you were here for approximately six weeks?

A. Yes.

Q. And Mr. Jackson had a condo right across the street?

A. Yes.

Q. And you testified before, I believe, that during that six-week period on at least half of the occasions that your son was with Mr. Jackson in Mr. Jackson’s bedroom in that condo, correct?

A. I think so.

During that occasion, Wade also visited the ranch and spent time in Michael Jackson's bed.

Q. Okay. Now, during the six-month period, I want to just concentrate on the period that we’re talking about, the May visit, you also visited the ranch on occasion, did you not?

A. Yes.

Q. And when you visited the ranch on those occasions, you slept in the guest cottage, correct?

A. No, I slept in the house.

Q. And where in the house?

A. In the rose bedroom. In the rose bedroom.

Q. Okay. And your son slept with Mr. Jackson?

A. Yes.

Wade corroborated his mother's testimony.

Q. Was there a place where Mr. Jackson was living in, either Westwood or Century City, where there was a hotel across the street?

A. Yes.

Q. And would it be the case that periodically you would visit him there, your mother would stay in the hotel, but you would stay with him in his room?

A. One time when we came over, we stayed -- I think it was the Westwood apartment, his Westwood apartment. There was a Holiday Inn that was across and we stayed there most of the time. And then certain nights I would go over to Michael and stay with him.

Q. Mr. Robson, were there ever occasions where you stayed with Michael Jackson where you didn’t sleep with him in his bed?

A. Yes.

Q. How often did that happen?

A. I don’t know. Maybe three, four times.

Q. Three or four times over years we’re talking about; is that right?

A. Yes.

Q. So, for the most part, the overwhelming majority of times you shared his bed with him?

A. Yes.

At the Mirage Hotel in Las Vegas, Wade usually slept with Michael in a separate room, except for one night when the entire family gathered to sleep in the same bed.

Q. So just to recap just a little bit, when you were in Las Vegas, you went there by jet. Do youk now whose jet that was?

A. Steve Wynn.

Q. I’m sorry?

A. Steve Wynn’s jet.

Q. Steve Wynn. And you went to a hotel?

A. Yes.

Q. Which is The Mirage?

A. Mirage.

Q. And you stayed in a suite?

A. Yes.

Q. And except for the night -- or the day when you all stayed in bed watching cartoons, eating popcorn, your son slept with Mr. Jackson and you slept in the other room?

A. It was one night, yes.

On one occasion, Wade and Joy were scheduled to board a flight, but Joy was filled with distress as she couldn't locate him. She hadn't heard from him in two days, and all she knew was that he was with Jackson.

Q. Now, do you recall an incident that occurred where you were supposed to catch a plane and you couldn’t find your son?

A. Yes.

Q. And the fact is that you hadn’t seen or heard from your son for two or three days?

A. I think two.

Q. And he had been with Mr. Jackson during that entire time; correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And I believe what you said was you were upset and you were hurt by this, correct?

A. I don’t remember that.

Q. You called a number of people trying to locate your son, correct?

A. I was trying to call Michael, and he was in the recording studio, not answering, not receiving phone calls. And I think I called Neverland to see if they had gone to Neverland.

Q. Well, you called Neverland and you got the Quindoy -- Mr. Quindoy, correct?

A. I don’t remember.

Q. Do you know who Mr. Quindoy is?

A. Yes.

Q. And you were very upset and wanted your son to be returned so he could make the flight?

A. I called to ask if they perhaps were at Neverland. That’s all I remember.

Q. You don’t remember saying that you needed your son returned, that you were very upset and you were going to miss the plane?

A. No, I don’t.

Q. Did you call Norma Stakos trying to locate your son?

A. Yes.

When Joy finally made contact, Michael Jackson informed her that they had been in the recording studio and promised to bring him back.

Q. Now, the prosecutor asked you about Mother’s Day at Neverland?

A. Yes.

Q. Remember that?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. And you learned that Wade and Mr. Jackson were in a recording studio that day, correct?

A. Not that day. That was -- that was the time that we were staying in Westwood, and Wade and I had our ticket booked to return to Australia. And he had been at the recording studio with Michael for a couple of days, and I just hadn’t heard from them. I know that they were working long hours, and then they’d take off again the next day. And I was getting --

MR. SNEDDON: Move to strike as a narrative,

Your Honor. Objection.

THE COURT: Sustained

Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Do you remember anything else about that day at the recording studio?

A. No, just -- I had called Norma looking for him, and she found them. She said they were in the recording studio and, “Michael is bringing him back to you. They’re on their way.”

Another incident occurred on Mother's Day in 1990, when Joy had not seen Wade at all that day because he was with Michael Jackson. In 1993, she testified to Larry Feldman that she expressed her concerns to a Neverland security employee, Charli Michaels, stating that she was upset that her son preferred spending time with Michael rather than with her. However, during her testimony in 2005, she could not recall if she had actually said that. June Chandler also testified that she felt distressed when Jordy began to distance himself and show a preference for being with Michael.

Q. Now, do you recall an incident that occurred on Mother’s Day during 1990 on a trip to the ranch?

A. Yes.

Q. And you were upset, correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And you were crying at one point?

A. Yes.

Q. And the reason for that was that you had not seen your son all day, correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And it was Mother’s Day?

A. That’s right.

Q. And you found out that the reason that you hadn’t seen your son that day was because he had been sleeping all day, correct?

A. I think so. Yeah.

Q. And you spoke to some people at the ranch about your feelings, did you not, one of the employees?

A. I think someone asked me if I was okay.

Q. And you told them that you felt that your son would rather be with Michael Jackson than with you, correct?

A. I don’t remember saying that.

Q. Do you know somebody by the name of Charli Michaels?

A. Yes.

Q. And who is Charli Michaels?

A. I think she worked security at the ranch.

Q. And did you tell Charli Michaels that you felt that the defendant, Michael Jackson, was separating you from your son?

A. I don’t recall saying it.

Q. Do you recall testifying to that in your deposition with Mr. Feldman?

A. No.

Q. Would it refresh your recollection if I showed you a copy of the deposition?

A. Yes.

MR. SNEDDON: May I approach, Your Honor?

THE COURT: Yes.

THE WITNESS: Okay.

Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: Does that refresh your recollection?

A. I don’t remember saying it, but I testified to it.

Q. I’m sorry?

A. I said I don’t remember saying it, but obviously I testified back then about it. I don’t remember saying it.

Q. You said that Wade would rather be with Michael than with yourself and you were upset about it?

A. Well, I read it, but I honestly don’t remember saying it.

On Wade's initial visit to Neverland, Michael Jackson asked Joy if he could take Wade on a trip to Japan. During a 1993 deposition to Larry Feldman, Joy recounted that when she inquired about Wade's preference, he expressed a desire to remain at Neverland. Ultimately, it was Michael's decision to cancel the trip in favour of Wade staying with him.

Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: I asked you a question about whose decision it was to cancel the trip to Japan. And I asked you if it was, in fact, Mr. Jackson -- that you had stated previously in your testimony it was Mr. Jackson, and you said you had no recollection of that, correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And did you have a chance to review your deposition for Mr. Feldman prior to coming to court here today?

A. I don’t remember reading that.

Q. Would it help you to refresh your recollection if I showed you the deposition?

A. Yes.

MR. SNEDDON: With the Court’s permission, Your Honor.

THE COURT: You may.

MR. SNEDDON: Or Mr. Mesereau? Bob?

MR. MESEREAU: That’s okay.

Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: The procedure is you just read that to yourself quietly, and then I’ll ask you a question, okay? And I want to direct your attention to page 181, and from lines 4 to line 9. And you can read anything else you want.

A. Okay.

Q. Having read that, does that refresh your recollection as to whose idea it was to cancel the trip to Japan?

A. Well, it says that Wade was given the choice, and Wade preferred to stay at Neverland.

Q. It says, “After the first weekend that we were there, he cancelled the trip because he wanted to stay and spend some time with us,” does it not?

A. If you read further down.

Q. Yeah, it says, “But he asked to go on this trip with your son,” and “I offered to let Wade go with him”?

A. Further.

Q. Do you want me to read the whole thing?

A. No, just a couple, few more lines.

Q. It doesn’t get any better.

A. Just a few more lines. It will say exactly what I said.

Q. And then Wade had a choice of going to Japan or staying at Neverland, and he chose to stay?

A. Yeah. That’s what I said, Wade was given the choice. And he decided to stay at Neverland.

Q. But it was the defendant’s choice not to go to Japan, as you testified.

A. He had a business trip and he cancelled it, and because Wade decided to stay at Neverland, but it was Wade’s choice.

Q. Thank you.

On another occasion, Michael stayed at the Robsons' rented condo in Hollywood. Jackson spent the night on the couch in the living room with Wade.

Q. When Mr. Jackson stayed with you at your Hollywood apartment, how old were you?

A. I would say 11 or 12.

Q. Did he share your bed with you at that time?

A. Yes.

Q. All right. There was one bed that you had in your room; is that correct?

A. No, it was actually -- it was a -- like a futon that was our couch down in the living room.

Q. So both of you stayed on the couch in the living room?

A. Yes.

Joy recalls this story in her 2016 deposition and notes that it lasted for two nights. Additionally, the living room was situated on the upper floor of the duplex, distinct from the other rooms. Michael was seeking refuge from his wife, Lisa Marie Presley.

Read the transcript here.

Over a six-month period, the Robsons made several visits to Michael at Neverland. During these stays, Joy rested in a guest room while her son shared the master bedroom with Michael.

Q. Okay. Now, during the six-month period, I want to just concentrate on the period that we’re talking about, the May visit, you also visited the ranch on occasion, did you not?

A. Yes.

Q. And when you visited the ranch on those occasions, you slept in the guest cottage, correct?

A. No, I slept in the house.

Q. And where in the house?

A. In the rose bedroom. In the rose bedroom.

Q. Okay. And your son slept with Mr. Jackson?

A. Yes.

Contrary to what fans claim, Joy never entered the room unexpectedly. She always knocked on the door and waited for either Wade or Michael to respond. Additionally, Michael had an alarm system in place.

Q. Do you recollect your always having to go through a locked door to get into his room?

A. I mean, I would always knock first before I went anyway, so I don’t have any idea whether the door was locked or not. But I would never just walk in. I would always knock and someone would open the door.

Q. What typically would happen when you’d knock?

A. Wade would answer the door, or Michael.

Q. Okay. And would someone open the door for you?

A. Do you mean --

Q. When you knocked and someone responded, would they typically open the door for you or would you open the door yourself?

27 A. I think someone would open it for me.

The last time Wade recalls staying with Michael Jackson was at the Sheraton Hotel when he was 14 years old. Once again, his mother was not there.

Q. Did you ever have a conversation with him about whether or not you should continue to sleep in his bed?

A. No.

Q. Remember the last time you slept in his bed?

A. The last -- I think it might have been when I was about 14. It was at a Sheraton Hotel in Los Angeles.

Q. And how did you happen to be there with him?

A. I stayed with him for I think it was just one night.

Q. Did you call or did he call you?

A. I don’t remember.

Q. Was your mother there?

A. No.

The Robsons' first visit occurred in January 1990. During that time, Wade shared a bed with Jackson at Neverland for about 9 days, and a further 7 days in a hotel in Las Vegas, and Jackson's apartment.

In May 1990, Wade stayed solo with Michael Jackson for half of the six-week nights, totalling 21 nights. Wade made a second visit in February 1991, exclusively to Neverland, for a week before relocating to the USA, which accounts for an additional 7 nights.

Wade was later asked how many times he stayed in Michael Jackson's room at Neverland.

Q. How many times do you think you’ve stayed in Mr. Jackson’s room at Neverland?

A. Same amount of times as I’ve been there.

Well, no, that’s not true, I’m sorry. I’ve been there a bunch of times without Michael, just with other friends and family traveling there. But, I don’t know, maybe 15 to 20.

Q. And at no time has any sexual contact ever occurred between you and Mr. Jackson, right?

A. Never.

It's important to clarify that this doesn't refer to 15 to 20 nights, but rather 15 to 20 trips to Neverland, where he shared a bed with Michael.

Joy mentioned that after relocating to the U.S., she struggled to settle in. She noted that MJ was only present four times during their visits to Neverland. However, upon reviewing her testimony, it became evident that she was only discussing her visits with Wade, omitting the fact that Wade had also visited Neverland independently.

A. My memory is in the entire time we’ve lived here since 1991, we’ve only been at the ranch with Michael on four occasions in 14 years.

Q. Four occasions?

A. Every other time we’ve been here without him.

Q. Would that be the same for your son?

A. Yes.

Q. So --

A. He came one -- all the time by himself.

Wade reportedly stayed at the ranch multiple times, sharing a bed with Michael until he turned 13 or 14 years old.

Q. When did you stop sleeping with Mr. Jackson?

A. I guess when I was about, I don’t know, maybe 13, 14, something like that.

Q. Why did you stop?

A. I didn’t stop sleeping with him. I just haven’t spent the night with him, I mean, in his room or anything like that since then, I don’t think.

Q. You haven’t gone back to Neverland since you were 13?

A. I have. Not with him.

Q. Have you gone back to Neverland since you were 13 and actually stayed overnight?

A. Yes.

Q. On how many occasions since you were 13?

A. A lot. Same thing. 20, 25. Something like that.

Between September 1991 and September 1994, Wade visited Neverland and shared a bed with Michael Jackson on a regular basis. The exact number of nights he spent there is uncertain, and I cannot provide a precise figure.

What we do know is that there is a confirmed total of 45 nights, in addition to the visits Wade made to the ranch after September 1991. Although the available testimony makes it difficult to quantify these subsequent visits, Wade mentioned "15 to 20" instances of visiting Neverland and sharing a bed with Jackson. This estimate is somewhat vague. For the purposes of this analysis, I would suggest considering an average of about 5 additional visits. Wade noted that he could have stayed anywhere from a single night to "a week and a half at most" during those visits. Assuming an average of 3 to 5 nights per visit could yield a modest total of between 15 to 25 nights.

Adding these figures together: 45 nights plus the estimated 20 nights from subsequent visits gives a rough total of approximately 60 to 70 nights during which Wade spent the night with Jackson, whether at Neverland or elsewhere.

While Wade's claim of being abused 100+ times might initially seem exaggerated, the overall context suggests that such a figure isn't entirely implausible, especially when you consider that the abuse could have taken place multiple times within a single day, rather than isolated incidents, before it occurred again.